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Welcome to Momentum, a motorsports podcast powered by High Gear Success. I'm your host, Heather Wilson Schiltz. Here we share the stories and strategies that keep the world of motorsports moving forward. I'm excited to chat with Mark Scherrens, co-host of Moto Adventurer Unscripted Podcast, and an avid adventure rider So, Mark, thank you for being here. Thank you for joining me. Thanks for having me on and good job saying my last name properly. Well, with my newer last name being Schiltz, um, I have to educate people on how to pronounce or spell that as well. So I can relate That's fair completely. I appreciate being on. So you have been on my list to have as a guest for a while. You probably didn't know that, but I kinda keep a list of potential guests. And I feel like you've been on a a media tour lately though, because you were just a guest on Tallboys and Trackmasters. So shout out to James and Trevor, also a great show. And you were just updating listeners on more of your backstory with Moto Adventurer Unscripted Podcast as well. So it's been like the Mark Scherrens' media tour. Ha, you're gonna give me a giant ego that I trust me do not need at all. But yeah, it has been. It's kind of funny because I used to do all these big rides like way back in the early 2000s, like hundred people, you know, adventure rides. And then I kind of like stepped away from doing that for a long time. And then Drew kind of brought me back into the, you know, I don't I don't wanna say spotlight, but off to the side of the spotlight a little bit, you know. So it's It's a fun ride, man. I like it. adventure riding for I think I read like twenty five years. So what originally pulled you to adventure riding? Was that the first segment of riding that you ever did? Yeah, basically it it kind of was. I mean, I always wanted dirt bike. My dad had Harleys and stuff my whole life, in and out of that whole thing, you know. And then I just always wanted a dirt bike, but we always lived in the suburbs and there was really nowhere for me to do it. So I got to be like a grown man, like I was 22 or 23, whatever. Got out of college, I'm like, I'm gonna go buy a dirt bike. I bought a brand new TTR125LE and taught myself how to ride for like for better or worse. Probably for worse, to be honest. And then I really quickly got tired of riding in circles and went and bought a KLX 400 um dual sport bike. it was downhill from there. I I I really just wanted to explore and check things out more than I wanted to ride around in, you know, predetermined loops and stuff. So that's kind of how I got into it. What was the experience of teaching yourself how to ride like? It was the complete opposite of everything that I know you teach and preach and the same for myself. It um, I mean, man, I uh I had like some redneck at work that had like a YZ85 he was riding around on, and we just went out in the woods and he showed me like, all right, man, here's the clutch and here's the throttle. And, you know, I did the like, you know, the classic like whoop right into the wood pile, you know, next to the field kind of thing. I mean, I remember I twisted the handlebars and hit my sternum with the end of the handlebars and it left like the mark of Zorro on my chest. And uh yeah, I quickly realized that I needed to actually learn how to properly ride a motorcycle if I was ever gonna get on the street. So there was a lot of things I did wrong trying to do that. At least you learned that lesson in the dirt though instead of on the street, because I hear a lot of stories of people just trying to practice like first time out on the street, which is terrifying to me. Yeah, there's I mean, the good thing about the dirt, right, is there's no generally not any cars coming at you. And it's anything I did was a mistake of my own, not because, you know, the latte spilled in that guy's lap or whatever and he ran off the road. So learn in the dirt first. And I honestly, like, I think everybody should learn in the dirt first, whether you actually wanna be a dirt rider or not, because it saves your butt so many times when you're on the street and you and you know, you hit that patch of gravel that you're not expecting. You learn to expect what the bike is gonna do when when that sort of thing happens. So yeah, it's I did do that right, but that was about the only thing. I'm of that same opinion that it's really beneficial to learn to ride off road before learning to ride on the street. And also like the dirt's a little more forgiving. I'm not gonna say it doesn't hurt when you crash in the dirt, but uh definitely not as much as sliding across asphalt. Yeah, one hundred percent right. And, you know, you get some padding and you get a nice open, you know, helmet, you know, a motocross style helmet instead of a nice enclosed helmet, which, you know, tends to lend itself to claustrophobia and stuff for some people. It's it's the way to go. It's easier to pick that dirt bike up. It doesn't matter if it has scratches and bumps and bruises, and you know, you don't you're not destroying your brand new prized street bike that you just bought. Absolutely. Thinking back to your first adventure rides, how did you get into that? And were you riding with other people or was it really just a solo adventure for you? Yeah, it it definitely started off solo and then it quickly grew into meeting some friends and things. It was um right around like 2003, 2004, the Adventure Rider Forum was really popular. It was kind of it was like it's heyday. And Drew and I have talked about this a lot. But I started this group called The DOGS the Dual Sporters of Georgia. And it was just a regional subsection on that forum. And we just needed a place to post all of our rides and all of our meetups as we started meeting people and having a bigger group to go riding around with. It it it really formed some good friendships that I still have today. But like before that, I would just go I it's so funny. I I lived on this road that had a dirt road behind the neighborhood and I would ride that KLX up and down that dirt road like I must have done it a thousand times. But and all those people on that road were probably going, What is this idiot doing? until I got brave enough to actually start going out on proper streets and exploring, you know? And I would get this map of the Chattahoochee National Forest, which is the big forest in the North Georgia Mountains. And I remember just going out, taking that map with me and in highlighting the roads that I had, you know, quote, discovered on my own and coming back at the end of the day and trying to remember, you know, what I had done that day and making notes. I mean, I had a paper, you know, with, you know, road names on it and highlighter marks all over it and scotch tape holding that map, you know, together because it was falling apart. So it It it was way it was before GPS was really a thing and you had to do things the old fashioned way. So yeah, kinda kinda went from solo into groups and forming friendships and and organizing that way, if that makes sense. My husband and I are also really bad at remembering like where we've been or remembering to start like a uh GPS or like a tracker of sorts if you're using uh Rever or something like that to track your ride. So we're people that kind of generally just like to head out and explore, even if we're in West Virginia or somewhere else, then we always get back and we're like, Oh man, I wish we would have recorded that ride 'cause we really have no idea like where we went. Yeah, that can be hard. That's where the GPS stuff comes in handy, which is funny because I never use a GPS. I don't think I've once recorded a track that I've ridden electronically. I just for some somehow I just have this sense of I don't really get lost. I kind of always know where I am. I have a good sense of direction, and I'll just come back and and take that route that was in my head and put it on paper. I like to see the big picture. You know, that's I I still love maps. That's if I had to choose. It'd be maps all day for that reason. Do you feel like meeting people today when riding is a lot different or similar to like meeting on the forums back in the day? Uh it's a good question. I think that I think it's different. Um, like we would meet when we would meet on the forum. I mean, you have, you know, you have anonymity, if I could say that properly, anonymous, anonymity, you know what I'm trying to say? Where you have a code name on the forum, right? And you're not, you know, I'm not Mark. I was known as Flux, right? And so, you know, it's it's uh I remember one time we met up with this this lady that We didn't know was a lady rider. And we all showed up and literally walked right by her, as terrible as that is to say, because we didn't recognize her as somebody who was meeting up in the group. Right. So my point is you just didn't know the, you know, you didn't know their face, you didn't know their age, you didn't know their gender or any of that stuff. Now I think when you meet up, and especially with like Facebook has their rules, like you can't have like a fake name or anything like that, you generally at least you know, you can kind of cyber stalk them a little bit and go, yeah, I want to ride with Heather. She looks like she's cool to ride with, you know. Um, it's a I think it's different in that regard. You follow me on that? Yeah, I mean it I was never like on the forums. That was that was not my my era, but it reminds me of like it reminds me of like screen names, like AOL, AIM, screen names and like not being their real identities, which like I guess I I knew that about forums, but I kind of forgot that everybody had like their code name, like you were saying. And now it's funny if like people on Facebook or Instagram or any of those other platforms like don't have their profile picture or it's like a code name, like you call them out for that. Because usually they're being jerks about something if they don't have their real name on there. But back then everybody was probably just sharing information. But it was interesting that you didn't really I I think you could post photos, right? But you couldn't really, you know, see what the people look like or get a good Glimpse of their personality. Yeah, post. You could completely post photos all you wanted to. I mean, that's one of the big reasons we started that that dog thread on ADV Rider was just because we wanted we would get back from a ride and we all had our pictures that we took. And it was like you weren't texting them to each other back then. So it's like, what do we do? You host them on photo bucket, which also coincidentally destroyed the forum in one false swoop, right? And now we could all, you know, check out each other's pictures and talk about the ride. So It was um it was a weird time. It was like I feel like there was like a five to ten years where the forums were king and then, you know, like I said, Facebook kind of stopped hosting pictures for free. Facebook or photo bucket, I mean Facebook came along and that that's no more. So you have to find new ways to form your community, you know. It is interesting, kinda like blast from the past on just different pieces of technology that, like you said, were like king of the time and then they just kind of fade away. Like it could have a good five, ten year run, and then like a whole new generation doesn't even know that that stuff existed. Yeah, I mean, I don't think Facebook is a thing for like the next generation. They don't they're not into that stuff. I mean, my son's only eleven, but kids just a couple of years older than him, they don't care about having all that stuff. So I don't know. They're gonna have to meet people the old fashioned way, you know, hitchhiking or you know, meeting people at a bar or something like that. I don't know what they're gonna do. They gotta figure that out. But that's a them problem, not a me problem. Um, I take it you've probably ridden all over the country. So are there a few places that stand out as hidden gems to you that maybe don't get enough attention as they should? Yeah, totally. It's um I've been lucky to ride all over the country. I live in Atlanta, Georgia, basically like 30 minutes north of Atlanta. So my stomping grounds are like uh North Georgia, western North Carolina, eastern Tennessee. There's all kinds of gems in the in the southeast uh United States that never really get. I feel like everybody talks about the West. You know what I mean? Like the West Coast is the business, and and it is the business. I love going to Colorado. We go out there every couple of years. But just on the East Coast, that tri-state area of Georgia, North Carolina, Tennessee, it's undoubtedly mile per mile, some of the best riding that you could do in the entire country. Not to even mention when you get up to like the Red River Gorge area in Kentucky, you know, east of Lexington and all that stuff. Um I as far as like a gem like that, I could name, not really. I think you just aim your handlebars and you start riding and you're gonna discover. Like the culture changes as you move from county to county. The people tend to change, what their values are tend to change, the topography starts to change. That's what I love about it. You know, that to me, that's the g that's the hidden gem is actually getting out and yeah, the riding is phenomenal, but then getting off the bike, take five, ten, fifteen minutes and you know, have a snack sitting. I always joke around that my favorite thing to do is to sit on a curb of some local gas station and just have a Coke or whatever. And because I ride adventure bikes, you know, most people are not still when you get in the boonies, they're not accustomed to seeing that type of motorcycle. They're used to a Harley or a quote unquote crotch rocket or whatever. And they want to ask you questions. They want to talk about where you've been, where you going, you know, that sort of thing. And to me, that's my jam. I love that kind of thing. Mm. Are you a foodie person or it really doesn't matter? You're Well, I I am a foodie, but I also am not a food snob. Like I will roll up on, you know, a gas station slice of pizza as quickly as I will go in and, you know, enjoy a nice, good, you know, steak cooked to perfection. So it to me, I can find the appreciation in a roller grill hot dog as much as I can, you know, anything anything else. And really I like to cook myself. Like I hate going out to eat a lot of times because I'm like, yeah, I could have made that at home. for cheaper and it would have been better. So yeah, I I will I will eat some food. Have you done uh any sort of like moto camping, moto cooking like while you're out on rides or not so much? That I'm not good at because it's too much effort, right? So, like by the time when we go moto camping, I hate lugging all that crap with me, right? To have like a quote unquote good meal. Like I could do it, I could figure it out. But to have all that stuff, it takes up too much space. It's too heavy. It's too much effort. By the time I'm done riding all day, I just want to set up my tent. That's number one. When you find your spot, you've got to set your tent up immediately. Do not procrastinate on that. But then I'm like, yeah, I'll just eat like some, you know, boil in a bag food out of a jet boil or something like that. And to me it's just okay, we got the food, good to go. I do have friends that love to cook when they go camping and I'll throw in on that any day and I'll I'll wash the dishes. But yeah, I'm not interested in actually doing the cooking there. That makes sense. Totally. Well, I mean, my idea of camping is coming back to our R V. So You don't have to you don't have to pack any of that stuff. You just come back and you've got uh running water, you know, a shower, fridge, sometimes air conditioning or heat depending on if you need it. So That's perfect too. I'm all for that. I'll stay in a tent, I'll stay in an R V. I'll stay in a mom and I love a mom and pop motel. Like you can where the outdoor outside door opens into the parking lot and everybody can kind of congregate around the bikes and hang out. Uh it doesn't matter to me. As long as it's, you know, cleanish, I'm good. And for us too, a lot of times we have our two golden retrievers with us. So they're hanging out in the camper for the day while we go ride and then we come back to them. Like we really don't go anywhere without them. So that's part of the part of the experience for us too. Do ever stress out when you're out riding and you're like, you know, I gotta get back because my dogs are gonna like pee all over the floor if I don't get back and like late, you know? For sure. also if it's like hot, like is the air conditioning gonna stay working? Like if we're plugged in at a campground or something, that's like a very real concern. one of our dogs also has epilepsy, so is he gonna have a seizure while we're So I mean, yeah, there are definitely concerns, but also it's like you you do have to like get out there and live your life too. So No doubt. No doubt. Interesting. I never thought about that before. Something to consider. Yep. do you have any like memorable interactions with strangers that happened because you were on a motorcycle? So you talked about sitting on the gas station curb. Is there a story like that or is there another instance where you met somebody because you were on a motorcycle and had this really interesting interaction? Well, I've told this story before, but I'll tell you now because it's by far my favorite one. Um, they had one of the uh old international motorcycle shows that they used to do. They had it in Greenville, South Carolina, and a buddy of mine and I were riding KTM 950 Adventures. And we were we were riding to the show and I don't even know where we were, Heather. We were literally in the middle of nowhere. I mean, it was this complete redneck gas station. Listen, everybody, I'm a redneck, so I get it. Okay. But but this thing was like, it was a trashy gas station. We were literally sitting on a curb having an RC Cola or something. This lady pulls up and she's driving one of those old, you know, Dodge caravans with like the woody side panel on the side, right? Like it it was very aged. Half of that fake wood was falling off of this thing. She looked like Honey Boo Boo's mom, you know, and just My buddy Coates and I just look at each other like and as she's pulling in the in the into the parking spot, she's staring at us, Heather, like staring us down, and we're going, Oh dude, here we go. Oh man, what is this? She gets out. Now keep in mind, this is about the time when Charley and Ewan did Long Way Around, right? So that was their the first I should ask, you've seen that series, right? I am aware. I don't know if I've ever actually watched the full length, but I I know who you're talking about. Okay, so you know that they wrote that they wanted to ride KTM nine fifties and KTM basically told them no. I think I did know that, yeah. Okay, so that's part of the story. And it's a small part of the story, but it's part of it. This redneck lady Heather, she gets out of the car, and the very first thing she does is she opens that door. She goes, KTM, that's one of them boys that those boys Ewan and Charley wanted to ride that bike around the world, but KTM told them no. And we're looking at her like, what is happening here? Like, you know, how did you know about that? So she was a she was a huge fan of. Long way around and she loved that series and she'd never seen a KTM in person. So we got to tell her all about how much we loved riding KTMs and she went on her merry way and that was it. But I just to me it was a classic case of, you know, cliche as it is, don't judge a book by its cover, because we were totally judging it by its cover and we shouldn't have been. And she popped out wanting to know about those bikes and it blew our minds. That's my favorite one. Well, and still to this day, I mean, obviously KTM Street Adventure has been around for a number of years now, but there is still a huge segment of the population that does not know what that brand is. Like you said, if it's not a Harley, they they don't know any other brand. A Harley, a Honda, you know, KTM would not be one that most people would pick out. It's a hundred percent true. I mean, it's around me in North Georgia, like adventure bikes, they're they're all over the place, right? I mean, there's so many of them here. You could throw a stone and hit a BMW. But when you get out into rural America, they're still not used to it. You know, you look like something from another country. And back in the early two thousands or whatever it was, late two thousands, it was that for sure was a thing. So it was it was crazy. Well, and then like a little bit different personas, right, than Harley Riders and also like how we dress as adventure riders. I always say like we look like space martians with our adventure riding gear versus the Harley Leathers. So I mean very different pictures painted in people's minds. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. The Power Ranger look and all that stuff. But that that story blows my mind every time I tell it. I can I can still it was whatever, twenty years ago or whatever, I can still picture that lady in my mind. It's cool as heck. I love it. A lot of people are like heavily focused on the bike. Like they're they're tech people, their gearheads. Is that you or do you focus more on like the people, the places, the experiences? Well, I d I do love the bike and I've been through several of So I mean, I love the bike. I love the gear. I don't care much about the tech. That's not my jam. But I I really like the travel aspect of it. I mean, I've kind of always said that I'm kind of like an explorer or traveler first and a motorcyclist second. And I don't really know if that's true anymore, but that's how it started. And um, it's probably fifty fifty now. So it I really do. I mean, it's funny. I went I went riding with with our buddy Drew a couple well, it was actually a year ago now, but he always thought I was joking about my my mentality on this till we stopped at a gas station and he just he didn't want to take his helmet off. Like he just wanted to dump some gas and go. And I'm in the gas station talking to the attendant for like 10 minutes and I come out and I've got like, this guy Drew, did you know about this road or that road? And he's like, no, how did you know about that? that dude just told me his entire life story and where all the good roads to ride are. So, I mean, man, the locals always know the good stuff. Always. So that's that's where I really like it. I can definitely see the difference in your two personalities as well. Like Drew has it all planned out ahead of time. He knows where he's going and what he's gonna do. Probably not much deviation from that plan versus a little more free spirit. Like you said, you're talking to people figuring stuff out along the way. Yeah, we we talk about this quite a bit on the podcast too, is like Drew and I have a lot of similarities, but there's a lot of really strong differences. And I think he would like I think he would just like start having a coronary or something if if he had to just ride, you know We're just gonna go that way, dude. And we're not I don't know what roads we're gonna take, you know, or I don't know the mileage between gas breaks or what have you. So and that's cool. I mean, that's awesome. You know, it's it's good to have a partner on the podcast that actually has everything. He has a plan and he's got goals and all that. I'm not good at that stuff. So yeah, it's uh it makes for a good team, I think. Do you think social media has made it easier or harder to find those travel experiences? Is there things that you've seen online that are like, Hey, I wanna go there, I wanna do that, I wanna go to this event or Yeah, I think it's made it a lot easier. and to be honest, I think it's made it too easy. So, like this is where I'm like the old man, like get off my lawn kind of soapbox, right? Because I always preach that you're never gonna respect um, let's just say a fire tower, for example. If you found that fire tower on your own and you just stumbled on it or you had some sort of inkling that maybe it was there. You're gonna love that. It's gonna be a treasure to you, right? It's I found this. This is so rad. If somebody tells you exactly what to expect, or worse yet, somebody posts their entire ride video getting to that fire tower, and you know where every rock is on the trail, you know where the ruts are, you know where the obstacle is. Dude, why even go ride it? That guy just did it for you, you know? And so I really think that you have to work or you should have to work for that experience and not just. You know, that's why I'm not good at following tracks and GPS, you know, routes and all that stuff. I just I would rather I go, that looks cool, but that looks a little cooler, you know. Does that make sense? Yeah, I I think it's definitely personality types in a lot of ways. Like some people love love the style that you are talking about, which I feel like I am more of that person than like planning, but also like there's always a time and a place for planning too. And sometimes it's just nice to be able to follow along. Yeah, it there's no doubt about it. And there's there's times like if you're going to a completely new area, like we went and rode some of the Colorado and some of the Wyoming BDR a year or two ago. I don't I don't live in Wyoming. I don't know where the good riding is. So I'll use that as kind of like my baseline. And yeah, I might find some stuff off to the side that I decide to take instead. But at least some of the homework is there. So I can't say that I'm like, I just I just always I never follow tracks or I just always have to, you know, aim my handlebars and go a different way. That's not necessarily true, but generally that's kind of my my position on it. Yeah, absolutely. backing up a little bit too, you said that you worked at a dealership in the past. So how long were you there? What was your experience like working there? And how'd you get pulled into that? Well, I didn't really get pulled into it. I kind of volunteered for it. So I work I work in landscaping. That's kind of my my trade, my job or what have you. But man, I wanted to get in the motorcycle industry real bad. And I I may I somehow became friends with a couple of people that worked at our local shop that's no longer around and they were multi-line. They sold Triumph, Suzuki, Yamaha, maybe a couple other things. I can't remember. But I I came in there as sales and like Heather, I never sold a single bike. I didn't sell one. I'd sold nothing the whole time I worked there. And I tried it for like a year, but I was I wasn't really doing it counting on money because I still had my actual job right. And I ended up doing like event promotions for them. And I ended up managing their um like newsletter and But yeah, it's it kind of led into doing event promotions, kind of became really what I did. So I would do that in the newsletter. And I had a great time doing it. I mean, I would start organizing like dual sport rides. We'd have like a hundred, hundred and fifty people ended up on some of these dual sport rides, which was a complete mind mind, you know, blow or whatever, just trying to figure out. The logistics of that as somebody who doesn't like plans, right? It went against everything in my being to organize that, but it was a great time. We did a lot of bike nights. Um, being a Triumph dealership, we had an English pub down the street that we would organize bike nights with. So that was pretty cool. Um, just to see the turnout and try to, you know, trying to turn those events, which I think is oftentimes missed by dealerships, and you're gonna know this way better than I do. You got to turn that event into money. Like it's great to have the event, but you're a business dude. And if you can't figure out how to like transform that event where you now you have 150 captive, you know, heads and helmets at your place, you got to capitalize on that. Right. And so that was the challenge. And I I enjoyed it. I was there, I did it a couple of years. I wasn't wasn't there a lifetime or anything, but it was a it was a good role. Yeah, you're definitely right about that. I mean, events I feel like are great like starts to building relationships with potential customers or maintaining relationships with current customers more than just like a transactional thing of like, come buy this bike, come by this part. So if they're having a good time and they get to know you, they get to know the staff. if you're having it at the dealership and they can walk around and touch and feel and see new stuff, like that's gonna translate into sales for sure. Do you feel like adventure riders twenty years ago or twenty five years ago are different or are similar to adventure riders today? He I was like pondering this question myself earlier, honestly. Like Really? Yeah. Mm. This is maybe where I make everybody mad because I think that they're I think adventure riders, there's so many more adventure motorcycles on the road now than there were 20 years ago. So by default, it's almost like, oh, I used to love this band and they were so awesome and they were so niche and like it was cool, right? And then every, you know, everybody discovered them because they had that one hit that got played on FM radio. And I don't know that it's that. Cool anymore, right? Like there's a correlation there to be made. There's a lot of uh there's a lot of adventure bikes that never really get ridden. They never really you don't I don't think you have to go on the dirt to be an adventure bike. So I'm not that's not my take on it, but I do think that I see a lot of like uh my dad being like the classic Harley guy, right? That transferring over to adventure riding type thing. Um I don't know. There's a there's a lot of uh there's a lot of information out there now about adventure riding. Not all of it's good, but man, sometimes you see something that's really popular, just full of nonsense. And it's funny, my brother and I were talking about a certain video on YouTube today, and we're like, me and him are texting each other back, like this guy's full of crap, dude. He doesn't know what he's talking about, and he's got 200 billion followers, and they're all taking what he says for gospel. And it drives me nuts if you can't tell. You know, I'm like, dude, this guy he puts a thousand miles on a bike a year and then gets rid of it. Give me a break here, you know. So I think people have to filter through the information that's being served to them. And that's the biggest difference in what was happening 20 years ago versus what's happening now, you know, if I had to sum it up in a nice nice little package. Yeah, I mean, thinking to some of my experiences too. So obviously I like I grew up in the industry. I've known a lot of people. I have a long history in it. And it's it's interesting when you talk about like filtering information. If you go to events, I can tell who's like for lack of better term, talking out of their ass. Like they're they're trying to impress me and tell me like everything that they know and like I can tell they don't know what they're talking about, actually. Like by them trying to tell me everything that they know. And so, like you said, but other people are listening to them thinking, like, this dude's really smart. Like, they know a lot of information. And I'm thinking, like, Yeah, you're not you're not really cutting it for me. And do you vocalize your opinion in those instances? Sit on your nope, you just go with it. Yep. I I I find that my mood greatly depends on what my reaction to those types of people are. Cause sometimes I'm pretty opinionated, right? And I I know that about myself. And my wife is always like, You gotta you gotta like just give that guy a break, you know. I'm like, dude, no, you know, but other times I've just like, I don't even feel like dealing with this idiot right now. I think my favorite ones, um, maybe maybe to laugh at more now are like the name drop ones. So like, do you know so and so? Do you know so and so? And like I'm like, dude, so and so is like basically my uncle. You know what I mean? Uncle and quotation marks. Like, yeah, I I know them pretty I'll I'll usually brush off like, Yeah, yeah, I'm I know them. You know, I don't I don't yeah, I don't let on that like literally like he's he's basically my uncle or he's my second grandpa or you know, whatever. Yep. Um Yeah, those are always kind of funny. But going back to what you were saying too, and this is what I was I was thinking about earlier. the adventure riders of twenty years ago, twenty five years ago, I feel like were more hardcore adventure people. And like you said today, some of the adventure riders like and I I'm not judging or discriminating against anybody like getting a bike. You can get whatever you want, enjoy whatever you want, like that's totally cool. But it's not necessarily that same flavor. No, it's not. I mean, you look 20 years ago, they I d I use this example. We didn't have quote adventure gear. We had dirt bike gear and we had street bike gear. And you had to mix and match, right? So like you had to decide like, am I wearing street boots or full-on motocross boots? And am I wearing a roost protector or am I wearing like a mesh, you know, Joe Rocket leather jacket or what have you, right? Now you got the dude who went into the dealership and hey, this is great for dealerships, man. You know, but like Hey dude, here's my here we're charging all this. Like I've got the the Dude, a jacket. It's not uncommon to find a $1,200 motorcycle jacket now. $1,200 jacket, excuse me, to allegedly just go bomb around in the dirt on. You're out of your mind, dude. There's no way. I spent like $600 on mine and I feel guilty as hell about doing it, you know? So it's like, yeah, we got the we got the ADV Rider catalog. We got the soft bags with the name brand. We got this windscreen. We got We did this to the bike because the internet told us we had to, or the bike was gonna blow up, you know? And and you can easily tell, like this dude has watched every YouTube video known to man about everything that that KTM is gonna do, or it's gonna explode and the world is gonna start rotating in reverse, and women are gonna start crying and children are gonna spontaneously combust because you didn't do that clutch slave cylinder mod, right? It's it it's crazy. I was really proud of myself lately. I actually just sold a couple sets of riding gear that I had had for a very long time. One was like a full-on Alpinestars street suit that I bought when I lived and worked in California. And I don't have a dedicated just street bike anymore. I have an adventure bike and a dirt bike. I haven't worn that gear in a long time, but it was still in pretty good shape. So I was like really proud of myself that I sold that. And then um there's some other I think it was like another set of adventure gear that was older. Cause I'm like, I have my one set of gear that I wear all the time and I I love and I don't really like switch it up. You know what I mean? I don't need to have like three different adventure jackets. I mean, the one that I have kind of does a bunch of different stuff. So I did start cleaning out the gear closet. It's uh I am a uh self-certified gear. I don't want to say the word for it, but it starts with a W and ends with or. And uh, you know, I go I love gear. So I at one time I thought I wanted to design motorcycle gear, right? And I would still love to do that. Like that'd be a dream job. So I'm always like buying this gear and I'm like, okay, what makes this good? What don't what do I like? What don't I like? And I have a rack behind me just full of jackets and pants and stuff. And I think I wear like maybe one of the jackets. The other ones are just sometimes I'll throw on, you know. It's good to it's good to refresh and and clean house once in a while. You um I know we've talked about Drew a little bit throughout this episode, but you started co hosting a podcast with Drew Faulkner, Moto Adventurer Unscripted. Yep. A couple years ago now. But how did you guys first meet? We actually probably crossed paths first at um there was a dragon raid, the triumph, one of the local triumph clubs put together something called the dragon raid at coincidentally the tale of the dragon. And um I think we for first kind of met there and then didn't really like hang out or talk or anything after that. But um I ended up going to one of the Red River scramble rallies that he organizes and we met, we talked, we kind of clicked. He I think was in a pinch, like some like a guest kind of canceled out on his podcast last minute. Does that sound like familiar at all? And then and then he's like, dude, can you help me out and come on? And I'm Yeah, man, let's go. And then that was a fun episode. We had a great time. A couple, I don't know, weeks later or months later, or whatever it was. It's like, hey, why don't we why don't we talk about this topic? And then it just started kind of becoming more regular. And yeah, it was probably like a year and a half ago. It was like, hey, let's be like, let's officially be a couple on your podcast, you know? And um, we just started doing these episodes together. Pretty much, I think now, um, up until like the last month, we did an episode every single week for the last for the last year, non-stop without fail. The only thing that threw a wrench in it was my son plays little league baseball and I coached his team last season. So towards the end of the season, I wasn't predictable enough to be counted on, you know. Um, and Drew had to uh take the mantle up on his own again. But when I came back, I felt good because he's like, I missed you, man. So it's been a good partnership. And like this is Drew's baby, but like I absolutely love being a part of it. And um, you know, we we're we're texting nonstop. it's funny, we don't talk on the phone. It's very rare that Drew and I speak on the phone. It's usually texting each other something or an idea for a show or like You know, hey man, check out this goon on marketplace selling his used KLR650 for 20k or whatever, you know. Um, and then we just save it all for the podcast. So that's you know, it's for anyone that hasn't listened, it's a usually about two hour long podcast, long format kind of thing, which I love because you really get to start knowing, you know, who you're talking to, um, or getting into the topic, right? Well, and finding the right fit for a co host is like super challenging. And I love that it happened like kind of organically, like you were a guest and then you kind of were friends and then you kind of dive into it because that working relationship and it really is a lot of work to put that together. Like you have to be able to balance like, are we relatively doing the same amount of work? Are we doing the same things? Are we doing different things? And that can get frustrating if you don't have the right partner. For sure. And like let me just say this now. I fully know that we do not do the equal amount of work. Like Drew does the work. Like we talk and we come up with ideas and stuff, but like Drew does all the editing, all the shorts, all the any sound effects you hear, all that stuff. That's a hundred percent Drew. So I basically log on and we talk and we have a great time. And then I log off and he works his magic. But what I really like about it is that he does listen to my input. I don't I I really don't just log on and we talk. I mean, we, you know, he he actually values the ideas that I have and and the differences that we have. We he's not it's like the president and the vice president, maybe not this current one, but like you don't want a yes man, right? Like you want somebody who doesn't just agree with everything you say. So my my favorite episodes are when we go back and forth and we kind of, you know, battle each other a little bit. I think it's fun. Yeah, I think that's I think that's totally rad. And also like you guys have guests on there sometimes. So how does that kind of change the dynamic of having three of you or maybe even sometimes four of you on there? Well, as you know, having been on one with multiple people with us, right? Like you gotta be real careful not to talk over over yourselves. And um we're pretty good about knowing at this point when like I know when Drew is done talking, right? Or I can see he's coughing and hits the mute mic or something like that, and then we just keep on rolling to cover the other one. Um, we try to let the guests do most of the talking when when those episodes come along, 'cause obviously He's the guest or she's the guest, right? And it's like, I want to know what this person has to say about it. But sometimes it takes a while to crack that guest's code and like get them to really open up. That's why I like the long format, because it might take 30 or 45 minutes sometimes for them to be comfortable and just, you know, say what's on their mind, right? sometimes they don't mind, they get right into it. Um, but yeah, that's it's a different dynamic. I don't think the attitude changes a whole lot, but it's a little bit of a different dynamic for sure. Also kind of on the industry side, you have a creative uh spirit and you do some freelance illustrating. So how did art kinda come into your life and how did it tie into motorcycling? Well, I mean, I I thought I was gonna draw comic books when I was a kid. So art's always been a part of my life ever since I was a baby. I mean, honestly, I just I went to school for art. So it's um to me, I just I love old school like pen and ink. You know, I'm not I can do digital work, but I really don't like it that much. I just like to sit down and start drawing things. I like I said, I thought I was gonna draw comic books when I was a kid and I really worked hard towards that goal. I just didn't go that route, right? For all the different reasons you don't do what you thought you were gonna do when you were a kid. I like drawing like rally shirts, like event shirts. Uh like I most recently did something for have I don't know if you've ever met Ben with Moto Camp Nerd. Are you do you know Ben? I think I follow him on social media, but I've never met him or really interacted. Those are those are people that you should pick probably talk to right there, to be honest with you. But um I did an I did like an advertisement for him to put in Sam Manicom's new book about traveling through China, you know? So it's just and like he he sent me like some camp food and stuff in exchange. Like I'm not, I have a job. I'm not trying to make money in this industry anymore or do any of that stuff. It's just for fun. So like if you have something that you need something drawn and you're like, hey, dude, does this sound good to you? And I'm like, that sounds fun. Great, let's do it. If I'm the if I don't think it sounds like fun, I'm gonna just pass it on and or let AI and the robots do it for you or something, you know. That's my new current thing is down with AI, right? But yeah, yeah. I can't stand the AI flyers that all these event organizers are doing, It's for you, it's gotta be tough to watch. But like um, we interviewed a dude named Sam Bendal a couple months ago and and Drew put a short of his for in uh on Instagram not too long ago and it just lit up like fire. But like he's he's anti-AI and now he's riled me up because I'm like, yeah, AI, these flyers between motorcycling restaurants, like my son's little league teams, like all this AI stuff. I'm like, dude, they all look the same. None of them stand out. They're the most unoriginal, like non-creative. This this was cheap and easy for you to do. Like put the effort into advertising your service or business that it deserves. Don't take this cheap, easy, non creative way of doing things. But yeah, it's it's insane. We could have a whole non-Moto related episode on AI and my really complex feelings on it because I do have a lot of complex feelings on it. Like it helps me a lot as a writer and for some like creative and strategy ideas. It doesn't do my writing for me. It's really just like a tool to help. But I'm really against it in the art realm of things because I like to hire and work with true artists and graphic designers and Then they're building all these data centers around my house too and the environmental impact and health implications and all kinds of crazy stuff. So yeah, I Yeah, it's it's really challenging 'cause it's on one hand it's like it helps me in some ways, but also it's like I really hate it in a lot of ways. So I think, you know, it's it's like anything. There are pros and cons and responsible ways to use it and and not. So Yeah, you're absolutely right. To me, it's a tool, right? Like it can be used in the art world. Like if you're using it as a sketch or like, hey, I need 15 ideas to bring to the client and I need them in 30 minutes. Like that's great, right? As a finished product, absolutely not. That's how I see it. Um, kinda to wrap up this episode, tell people what's in your garage, what you're loving now, and then where they can connect with you. Yeah, I um so I'm kind of a KTM guy through and through. So I got the Husky Norton 901 expedition now, which is just a KTM in disguise, right? I am absolutely loving this motorcycle, it does everything I wanna do. Um I've only got like 2,000 miles on it. So I'm not, I don't have much time on it yet. I just sold my 1090 Adventure in order to buy this thing. And I'm actually picking up a used 1200 GSA um this weekend, going to see my brother in Louisville who went to Wisconsin to get this thing for me. So a little bit more time with my son riding on the back of the motorcycle, a little bit more comfort than the 901 is going to give me. Um that's those are the only bikes I have right now. I'd love to add some more if anybody wants to donate a trials bike to me. You know, or a surron or something like that, like bring it on. I'll I'll ride it. Um, you know, you guys can definitely find me like we were talking about on the Moto Adventurer Unscripted Podcast with my buddy Drew Faulkner. Instagram's the best place if you want to connect with me. My Instagram is at ride.repeat. Ride wrench repeat. That's my that's my thing. And uh yeah, that's it for me. love that Instagram handle. Like it sticks out so much. Like I've always always loved that. So Well, I always thought I was gonna do like t-shirts with it or something. Like I've I've got a bunch of designs for it, but you know, just selling twenty dollar t-shirts isn't there's not enough skin in the game for that hassle, you know what I mean? But that was the idea with it. Ride it, wrench on it, repeat. Yes. Um I don't wanna do the wrenching part, but for for some people that's fun. I lo I love it. I I'd much rather work my bike has only goes to a dealership when it absolutely has to. Uh other than that I'll bust my knuckles are all bloody and busted up from working on it. Well, Mark, thank you for joining me and thanks to everybody for tuning in to Momentum. This has been a production of High Gear Success. If you want to connect or recommend a guest, head to Momentum Motorsports Podcast dot com. Until next time, keep the momentum rolling.