Welcome to Momentum, a Motorsports podcast powered by High Gear Success. I'm your host, Heather Wilson Schiltz. Here we share the stories and strategies that keep the world of motorsports moving forward. Joining me now is James Wright and Trevor Schoonover, co-host of Tallboys and Trackmasters podcast, as well as members of Fairmont Dual Sport Riders in West Virginia. So thanks for joining me. Thanks for having us. Yeah, glad to be here. So my podcast listeners know West Virginia is one of my favorite places to go adventure riding, to go camping. It's beautiful there. It's not that far from me. ah A couple years ago, James and I actually got to do some adventure riding together with a group that we know in West Virginia. Unfortunately, during that time, though, Trevor was out of commission with dual broken wrist. So we did not get to catch up. Yeah, so I missed that due to some pretty gnarly injuries. Broke both my wrists due to flat in my front tire and was on loose gravel. So I didn't think anything of it and went to go to the next turn. And the flat tire folded up under the rim. I think I high sided. And then I knew I broke one because when I got up, it was visibly wrong. and then got some more x-rays at the ER and they told me that they were both broken. that was a interesting time. Several months of challenges, I would assume. Yeah, I had to get a plate on my right side and you know I'm a year and a half out I think from that. I really don't have complications aside from a little bit reduced range of motion but the recovery was pretty rough. Yeah, I would imagine that would be pretty gnarly to kind of have both of your essentially your hands out of commission. You could probably use your fingers a little bit, but not very much. He was full time ref when our football games for a long time. Yeah, made it worse was that was going to be the last ride before I got married got married in September of that year. Didn't end up being the last ride. um And I got out of casts like a week and a half, I think before the ceremony. So had to go get my suit jacket, you know, final fitted because my casts were too big go through the armholes. And yeah, interesting time. Did you tell yourself, either in your head or out loud, that it was going to be your last ride before you went? Um, I don't know if I really vocalized it or anything, but like I just, I just decided like, I'm not going to ride, you know, within this period leading up to the wedding. James, I don't know if your family was like this growing up, but we were never allowed to say one more lap or going out for the last ride because that's when bad stuff happens. So even if, even if you think it's going to be your last lap, you were going to say, I'm going to go out for two more. And then you only did one. So I don't know if that karma was like catching up with Trevor there. Yeah, Karma is a, you know what, and anytime you mention that or vocalize it, it's going to put you on the ground immediately. so you just published your 100th episode of Tallboys and Trackmasters. How does it feel to have 100 episodes under your belts? It's kind of a relief in a way. um know whenever we got to like around episode 82, 83, just felt like we were constantly doing things and we weren't getting any closer to episode 100. no, it's been cool and it was really interesting to do it at Adventure Travel Day to break that century mark. So Adventure Travel Day was at the West Virginia State Capitol just a few weeks ago. What kind of goes on at that event? Yeah, so Adventure Travel Day and they kind of combined it with Motorsports Day too, so to be a little bit more inclusive. this, that entire thing was started by uh Senator Mark Maynard, he's from Wayne, West Virginia. He's a avid outdoorsman and motorsports enthusiast. And a couple friends of ours, Jerry Bain, uh Eric Larch and some others, Jed Smith. It's just a way to showcase adventure travel and tourism to our legislators in the state capitol. um I don't think that they realized just how big that this sport is, especially in the state of West Virginia. So it was a chance for businesses and, you know, people, different clubs, different tourism agencies and whatnot to get together, showcase that there's all these voices are here in the state. All this money is being brought into the state of West Virginia. um Tourism is one of the big drivers of the economy in the state of West Virginia now with all the dying industries such as coal and steel and oil and gas kind of having their boom coming and going. But yeah, just a way to say that our voices matter and get in the state capital and network all that sort of fun stuff. It's definitely a great opportunity to network. I did watch your guys' live stream from that event and I had a good laugh when you posted that for the first time in West Virginia's existence. said Tallboys and Trackmasters on the uh Senate floor, I think it was. Yeah, it was really funny. uh the, our, our old representative was Mike Devault. He's a really good friend of ours and a supporter of Fairmont dual sport riders. Uh, but he kind of stepped down here recently and, our new representative, uh, which was Garcia, I think he, uh, they, kind of introduced all the people that were there for adventure travel day, uh, in the Senate gallery. were up in the peanuts above all the stage down below, but yeah, it was really funny to hear. And introducing from my district in Fairmont, West Virginia, tall boys and track masters. I want to hear that on a prestigious Senate floor like that. Yeah, I love that. So out of all the episodes that you guys have done, do you have a favorite episode or a favorite topic that you guys have covered? Hmm. Well, you know, we do interviews, we do, um, you know, kind of in the weeds, analytics and statistics on different bikes and different disciplines and whatnot. But, uh, I would say at least one of my favorite interviews was a guy that I've watched on YouTube for many years, Wayne Dowsent from Australia. So it was really cool to get his perspective of what adventure and dual sport riding is like, uh, clear over there. And in that that continent, but it was really interesting to try to get our time schedules mixed or put together because I think he's like 13 or 14 hours ahead of us. But just a first international guest and having somebody that speaks our language but doesn't at the same time, there was a lot of back and forth there. And it was just really cool to figure out that he was just a down to earth guy that was cool to come on our show. So I think that was one of my favorites for sure. Going down and riding with him and his crew would be a definite bucket list ride. Absolutely. What was your favorite Trevor? ah Probably Wayne. mean just just for the the accent and the stories alone. It was it was great. It was really memorable. Do you guys look back at your early episodes and go, my gosh, because I feel like I definitely do that with my work from like a couple years ago. Like, man, that was kind of gnarly. I definitely do. I've been going back. we just recently started putting everything on Spotify as well. So going back and seeing those first, you know, 10 to 15 episodes, you're like, you guys are so over your head. You have no idea what you're talking about. And this production is terrible quality, like just those things. But you know, it's, it's definitely grown into a full-time production and uh, you know, the content is definitely improved. But yeah, looking back on that, it's like, You don't know how to talk to people correctly. You don't know how to interview. Like there's a lot of things that I criticize. Well, I still don't, but what we lacked in production, we made up for in the freshness of the ideas because we were doing, you know, the tech episodes and whatnot that were the first time that we'd done them ah versus we've gotten to a point kind of, you can only talk about the technical side of riding like bike setup, gear, tires, et cetera, so many times before it gets stale. So. Yeah. And in your early episodes, you didn't have very many guests. If I recall, it was really just you guys. And I find that that has to be even more challenging as a podcaster to come up with topics and then keep the conversation going between you versus interviewing somebody new every single week. You kind of have a different topic in mind. We at least lucked out in the sense that from an industry standpoint, there's been a lot going on, especially like middleweight adventure bike segments. So there was always something to discuss about who's releasing what bike, what are the pros and cons, what is the application for this bike, that bike, et cetera. But the point that we interview more and more interesting people has really helped. Yeah. And it, it's always, I've said this on other shows and stuff as well. Trevor is one of the few people that I I'm friends with that I can kind of have that higher level of conversation and get into the weeds about things. So, you know, those early episodes really were just a way for us to kick the wintertime blues. Um, we only, stream to the Fairmont dual sport rider group. So it was pretty inclusive and we know that that was our core audience. Um, and then we decided to kind of branch out to everybody else, but yeah, that's, There's always something to talk about and if not, man, we can pull some stuff out of our rears to kill an hour. Yeah, which we've had to do on several occasions. So it's worked out. Tell us how you both got started in riding and the different bikes that you guys have enjoyed through the years or have currently. this is going to be a long winded answer, but I started out riding when I was I was six years old. My dad had done some riding and racing growing up when he got married and had me and my sister. He kind of put the bike away and sold it and didn't do anything for a good while. But that was one of those things where a lot of my friends in school were riding where I grew up in Barrickville, West Virginia. There was an old Coleslag dump. behind the town and that's where you could go and ride and do anything you wanted to. So that's what all my friends were doing. That's what I wanted to do as well. So, uh started out on my neighbor's little Z 50 Honda. uh My dad kind of quickly nixed that. He said, if you're going to ride, you're going to learn to do it with a clutch. So he brought home a 1975 Suzuki TS 75 that was blown up. So we did top end on that, learn how to work on my own bike from a really young age. And then it just really snowballed from there. um My friend started racing. I started racing. My dad used me riding and getting away from where he could see me as an excuse for him to get back into it and start racing and riding. And my sister had enough of sitting around and watching us had a good time. So she got into it as well. And then my mother at 35 years old decided she wanted to start racing and riding as well. So it was a family affair from the beginning and it's been ingrained in my DNA since I was young. So I wrote a little bit as a kid. I think it was a YZ 80 and uh tore my ankle up and that was, you know, at the end of that. So I got out of college, got my first real job, got my own health insurance, got a bike and explored around Fairmont um solo for, I don't know, probably close to a year. uh Ended up getting a Kawasaki KLX 250. And the day after I bought it, I was going to meet my then girlfriend, now wife for coffee, uh, rode past, James and some guys from FDSR at Hardee's and stopped in, was just asking like, Hey, do you guys know any, any other trails or anything around here? And ended up canceling my coffee date and riding to Canaan with them. So that's, that's how I came to know James and FDSR. And from that point, I, you know, I've just been kind of bit by the bug. So that would have been, think, 2019. um I've since moved on to a KTM 350 EXCF, which is my favorite bike that I've had. I still have my Kawasaki. That's actually the one that I was on when I broke both my wrists. So. I think it's cool that you stopped in and just like randomly asked strangers like, Hey, where can I go ride? Because I don't think a lot of people would have the nerve to do that. Yeah, I was getting tired of riding the same stuff and was getting desperate for finding new stuff. you know, I sometimes think like if I hadn't stopped and talked to them, chances of me ever having fallen in with them was, you know, kind of slim. And I probably would have gotten bored with it really, because you can only ride the same stuff so many times before you, you know, before it gets stale and. Like I said, I'm really, I'm really glad that I did stop and talk to him because it's been, you know, a lot of friendships. Uh, it's been led to a lot of experiences and, uh, dual sport riding is probably turned into, is definitely one of my top three hobbies. God, it's fate, right? It's fate. Like, we wouldn't have the podcast, you we wouldn't have, I wouldn't have a really good friend in my life. Like, and like you said, it's, it is kind of one of those uh disciplines of motorcycling that it's, it's really inclusive. And that's one of my favorite parts about it is, you know, there's no shame in stopping and talking to new people. And maybe you don't get that at a racetrack or something. Um, but yeah, just being able to, uh, stop and see like-minded people and, Not be shunned or turned away to your skill level or what you're riding is probably one my favorite parts. Yeah, always been really receptive. Like anytime I've tried to stop and talk to somebody that I've bumped into on a trail or see on the side of the road, um everybody just seems eager to share their little loops that they know or lesser known roads and stuff like that. So that's been a really good aspect of this hobby. How did Fairmont dual sport riders also known as FDSR come to be? So Fairmont dual sport riders was started by Nick Hall here in Fairmont. and it was really just a, a loose Facebook group. Um, you know, just posting up a time to go ride and meet up and whatnot. Um, I kind of came into the fray through my dad. he had kind of given up racing and started doing the dual sport thing. And I, kind of had that in the back of my mind that that's what people that can't racer hack it on the track anymore do is the dual sport and adventure thing. So I wasn't really interested in it, but he convinced me to go one day I went out and was pretty disappointed that I didn't start that earlier in my life and um just kind of he knew some of the guys in FDSR Nick and Mike Schleicher, Justin Patosny and a bunch of the other boys. um So I kind of got you know into that fray and then it was really funny because most of those guys were guys that I had raced hair scramble races against back whenever I was in my racing career. So there was some familiarity there. Um, and they were definitely more on the hardcore side of dual sport riding. Um, was just basically just enduro riding with a license plate at this point, but, um, that really, you know, piqued my interest, uh, as far as what I like to ride. Um, and then, you know, just kind of grew and grew and grew. Um, I came on as vice president in, uh, 2020 and kind of took my background of being uh doing some event organization. I was the uh Northern chairman of the West Virginia Jeep Club for several years. So I kind of had that past experience of running a big organization, big group, and kind of brought FDSR to the forefront with that. So yeah, it started out as a loose Facebook group, and now it's the biggest dual sport and adventure riding motorcycle club in the state of West Virginia. What are some of the events that the club host? ah Every single year our big one that we do third weekend in July is the 304 detour dual sport and adventure rally It's two-day event based out of Fairmont, West, Virginia ah Saturday is what we call our hard or enduro loop for the uh nut jobs like us that would like to ride the really challenging stuff And then Sundays what we call the adventure or easy loop And it's more inclusive for beginner people to get out, still hit some trails, but see some really, really cool areas in the state of West Virginia. oh We are absolutely spoiled for choice when it comes to trails in our area. West Virginia is such a hidden gem on the East coast of the United States, as far as riding is concerned. um And we have a lot of really awesome landowners who are club members as well that allow us to come onto their property and ride during that event. And I think that's one thing that kind of sets us apart from a lot of different places is all these trails on Saturdays hard loop that you run, can only run them one time of the year and that's during our events. So it's all virgin, really fun stuff that we like to run. Um, we do a Memorial day ride every single year. That's kind of a free just show up and we'll figure out as we go type of thing. I usually have a route in my head that I want to run everybody on, but, um, we do the Memorial day ride. do that. We do some, uh, fundraiser stuff, um, toys for tots drives and stuff during Christmas and whatnot, but, um, Yeah, the Memorial Day ride and the 304 detour definitely are big draws of the year. Trevor, I don't know if you felt this way about James when you first met him, but James and I had a mutual friend that had invited me down to go for a ride. And I was probably most nervous about riding with James, to be honest, because I had seen his social media and seen the type of stuff that he likes that hard, challenging, like balls to the wall, crazy stuff. And I'm like, my gosh, I'm going to be so over my head. I was like so nervous, but uh Brian Holmes is like, no, it'll be fine. I'll choose the route. It'll be all good. And it was a very enjoyable experience. if, James had been leading, I'm not sure that I would have had that same, that same relaxed experience. no idea what to expect um because it was me and a group of guys that were complete strangers and I'm going to ride over to Canaan, which I was familiar with Canaan. Like James, I used to be big into Jeeps. Of course, still am. um But I had no idea what I was getting into, no idea what to expect. And honestly, I'm glad that I went into it not knowing anything at all, because otherwise I would have been you know, really second guessing myself as to what we were getting into. And then as we rode together a little more, um, I came to realize that, you know, there's different definitions of dual sport riding. so there's, you know, the easier side of it, which is more like fire roads, um, kind of like more like ADV type stuff, just, uh, not quite as much mileage. And then there's, what James and most of these other guys want to do, which is effectively, um, Enduro riding with a license plate, which is what ultimately led me to get a, uh, yeah, my KTM three 50 and, something that's a lot more, uh, friendly for like the hard Enduro side of stuff. And I probably wouldn't have it any other way. I mean, by this point I would have gotten bored with fire roads. Not that I don't enjoy them, but, uh, I really liked the challenge of, uh, the harder aspects of, uh, dual sport riding. Yeah, I don't think there's anything wrong with the type of riding that you guys like to do. It's just not what I usually like to do. So I was kind of nervous about it, but it's cool when you can find a group and have a good enjoyable ride. then also, like you said, Trevor, sometimes it's best not to know what you're getting into because maybe you wouldn't try stuff, but at the same time, it's also good to be a little prepared. That's like anytime that we're going to travel somewhere we haven't been and ride new trails. I don't, this is going to sound bad. I don't look at maps. I don't try to find any videos of people who have previously ridden it like Red River um that we went to last year with the great example. I didn't look at anything for it. I just went into it. I'm blind more or less and I don't know. It's, it's more enjoyable for me to do it that way because then I'm not like man, I know around this corner is, you know, this hill climb that's, you know, really messed a lot of people up in the past or anything like that. So the less I can second guess myself and the less I can expect, the better I tend to ride. Yeah, I wouldn't say that like, yeah, we're masochist. We may be in a way we like that type of riding. but it definitely sometimes can be a crucible, to weed out those that aren't like-minded as us. Um, and it is funny because it's like the, the more people that we, we bring in and ride with us in our group, seems like there are, you may have five new guys that come out and ride with us. Well, three of them are going to really enjoy what we like to do. So those guys just keep. continuing to come back, continuing to come back. And it's pretty evident quickly to see who didn't enjoy those types of rides because they don't come ride with us anymore. But those, those core group of guys that like doing what we do, I wouldn't want to ride with anybody else. whenever we're planning these trips or these events that we like to go to, we know that everybody's a pretty similar skill level and we are all going to mesh so well, our personalities, especially. Um, so that's, that's definitely my. type of people that I like to ride with is those types. Yeah. I And you're both involved with trail layout and trail maintenance for FDSR. So what are some of the things that you've learned throughout the years that make it a little bit easier? Don't try to please everyone. If you try to go into a ride, a route that you're putting together that, you know, your main goal is to make sure that 100 % of the people enjoy it. You're not going to serve yourself well. It's going to be an injustice to everyone else. But I think that was the hardest part for me was, was trying to set up something that most people like. You'll, you'll be more successful that way. um And, you know, take criticism. Well, take some feedback. and do what you can with that. But, you know, there's, there's so much that goes into it, especially like we did in 2020, which was our first year of doing the three or four detour that you take away and learn just like we did with the podcast. You look back at those first episodes, you're like, that's terrible. I can look back at the first couple of years of our events that we were doing and say the same thing. it's just learning through growth. Um, and then, you know, we, we pretty well got a, a grid, a good idea of, you know, what, we can physically go through with the majority of our people that come to our rides. What kind of trails we need to add or take away, give or take, but just a little bit of everything and just learning from growth. And isn't it crazy too when we say 2020, it seems like that was just yesterday, but now it's 2026. Like that's getting to be pretty distant. Yeah. You bring up that era. It is crazy to look back on that though and think that, you know, going into this year is our seventh year of doing the 304 detour. There's plenty of burnout sometimes with it, but it still gets me excited to know that that's coming up. And my mind never stops. I'm pretty sure I have undiagnosed ADHD when it comes to dual sports and ADV. But, you know, I've always got my mind going with routes and different... know, GPX files or where can we go? Where's this road go? I've always been that type of person. So I really do enjoy the route layout. Yeah. So we're talking about looking back to like our first, our first couple of events or our first couple podcasts. I think it's a great lesson and you don't have to be perfect to start. You just have to start. And the longer you wait to start, the more of a disservice you're doing to yourself because you're going to miss out on, you know, X periods of growth. The longer you wait. One of the things that we've talked about on our show in the past is You know, lot of people obsess over like the perfect bike to do X, Y, Z. Uh, one really what you should be doing is just taking the bike that you have in your garage and getting out there and having your own adventure. Yeah, that's, that's really what it's about for me. I've had as much fun on, you know, my KTM as I have on a six horsepower trail 90, I took across Canadian loop, uh, at one point. So, I mean, for me, as long as I'm out on two wheels, I'm having a good time. And yeah, I think a lot of people spend too much time waiting for the right conditions to get started. Yeah. And I'm a big believer of you have to try something like three times or three years, especially when it comes to like event organizing. You're not going to do it perfect or well, even maybe on your first couple of years, you're not going to have a sellout event more than likely in year one. so you have to keep doing it. And now after several years of things still aren't going well, maybe you need to really reevaluate and take a look at things, but generally a few years, a few tries like things get worked out. That was definitely definitely our experience, at least with the detour, because, you know, this it all started me and another key guy in FDSR Fred Miller, who actually did get to come and ride with us. We went to these Shenandoah 500, which was our first like organized dual sport event that we ever attended. And we just absolutely loved the vibe, the camaraderie that was surrounding it. And we were like, we can totally do this here in the state of West Virginia. And at that point, the only other dual sport and adventure event in the state was the stolen pig rally put on by Don and Kathy McCoy in the southern part of the state. Don had a pretty bad heart attack and had some medical issues and they quit doing the event. So we were like, there's a void to fill here. We can do a dual sport event in our area, showcase, you know, all the fun stuff that we have here in North central West Virginia to ride. So 2020 comes along. We have it set in stone that we're going to do it at the local 4-H camp. um know, deposits are paid, flyers made, the word's out, and we get some pretty good feedback that we're going to sell out. And lo and behold, the COVID epidemic happens, right? So, shuts it down. You weren't allowed to have, at least here in the state of West Virginia, you weren't allowed to have gatherings of more than like, I think 15 people at one point. ah So we're like, yep, all right, well that's a sign. uh signed from the good Lord to uh not pursue this. Don't do this. ah Well, they started relaxing some of those COVID restrictions to the point where you're allowed to have outdoor gatherings of a hundred people. you know, our, our thought process was what better way to social distance than behind a set of handlebars and behind a helmet. So ah we actually got a phone call back from the 4-H camp that we rented saying, Hey, you guys are allowed to have your event. If you want to, we can do it, you know, this weekend, which happened. be the third weekend in July. we decided to go ahead with it. We already had pretty much all the pieces in place uh from a logistics standpoint to pull it off. And, you know, a lot of other dual sport and adventure riding events canceled in 2020. So people were looking for something to do and they all swarmed our event and we were completely overwhelmed. We were overwhelmed. That was really something. It wasn't fun, was a, God, let's just get through this day. Yeah, was, yeah, it was a, you know, survive type scenario. So it comes and goes, everybody has a good time. I don't think anybody really got hurt and everyone enjoyed it. And they're like, when are we doing this next year? All right, third weekend in July, let's do it again. So, 2021, we decided to go all out. We rented the fairgrounds outside of Reesville, West Virginia, which is a really nice facility, full hookups, plenty of room for toy haulers, campers, everything. little bit closer to some of our harder trails. We're to do a two day event. Now you're to have a hard loop on both days and an easy loop on both days. We had a band, we had fireworks, just food vendors, you name it. We had it there and 41 people showed up for the entire weekend. So that was a huge bust. ah It was a really big blow to the ego in a way. And I remember at one point ah there's a local ah Doobie Brothers cover band here, Almost Brothers band. And they're really awesome, they really are. But they're on stage playing for like six people in the bleachers. I'm like, what in the hell are we doing here? This is not very successful. And we were gonna kind of back it in. I also wanted to dig into trail etiquette for dual sports and such. So what are your guys' advice or I don't know, I feel like sometimes people have been riding dual sports a long time and still don't have etiquette. for like new riders getting into it too, like what are some of the unspoken rules of trail riding? I would say, you know, it's really dependent on where you're coming from. um Are you somebody like Trevor that's wrote a little bit, but never did any kind of racing or anything like that. So you're fairly new. If you're that type of person, I would say to don't get in over your head. Obviously, if you're with a group of idiots like us and we're hitting all this hardcore stuff and you're not comfortable, ah you know, just bow out. There's no shame in that. Don't ride above your skill level. And then on the other side of that, if you're an idiot like me, you know, be more inclusive to the new guys. Don't try to run everybody away because they're slowing you down as a group. Um, and just, you know, keep an open mind. we come from all walks of life and you never know what people have going on in their background in their life personally. Um, so try to be more inclusive if you're one of those hardcore guys. Um, you know, and I mean, simply just don't be a dick. Yeah, I mean, this, this is a hobby where you're ultimately out there to have fun. And anytime I stop having fun while I'm riding, I'm like, what, what am I even doing this for? Um, but some, some pieces of trail etiquette for me, as somebody who's had to, you know, make it up as I went along is, uh, don't be the guy that shows up with a bike that, uh, has a lot of overdue maintenance. Don't be the guy that shows up with no trail tools. That's one of my big things is having an adequate trail toolkit. um A big thing for me is if somebody needs help, stop and help them. um Whether it be picking their bike up, helping to fix their bike, something like that. On the other side of the coin, be the guy who always expects somebody else to help them or fix their bike. There's a balance to be struck. um there's been some instances where like guys will drop their bike and they'll just turn around and look at you. It's like, just at least put forth 50 % of the effort. I'll come do the other 50 % if I can, but at least make an effort. But yeah, James made a really good point about trying not to get guys in over their heads purposefully. Sometimes it just happens. For me too, sometimes the pace of a dual sport, people have very different speeds and paces that they want to ride. And I'm always happy to pull over and let somebody go around. I do not try to be a roadblock in the middle of the trail. I know I'm not the fastest, also not the slowest, but I'm also not the fastest. And so for me, it's just like, just give me a minute when there is space for me to pull over and let you around. I will definitely let you around. But if we're on really tight single track and there's literally nowhere for me to go, like you're going to need to be a little bit patient until we get to a little more open space. Yeah, behind you honking the horn. Get out of way, come on now. and I don't know if you guys, I've heard different preferences on this too. So don't think there really is a rule for this as to which side of the trail to pull over to. I always just kind of follow like traffic rules. I tend to always try to pull over to the right. But I've heard different people say different things too. would say at least in my eyes, it's situational. So are you in an area where obviously there's a place on the right hand side to get off and get away from everyone? Do it there. Um, if same thing, if you're on the left hand side, if there's a row of trees and a little trail, you see that kind of goes off the main comes back, you know, go on the left side, but just do it where it's safe and where you're not going to injure yourself or take out the guy that's breathing down your neck. Yeah, so, you know, a lot of guys that we ride with have experience with racing. You're used to somebody behind you. Doesn't really bother you for some reason. For me, I hate having somebody behind me that I know is a faster and more capable rider. so like for my own mental sake, I try to pull off and let them by. So I spent a lot of time in the back. Um, my, my take is, know, I'm not going to get there fast, but I'm going to get there regardless. And, Especially like Red River. We were out there, which was kind of my first big ride back after I stuff my wrists up. I spent a lot of time riding at the back of my own pace, which is really my preference. But I've noticed that some guys treat it like it's a race and the sense that like, especially on the detour, the guys that ride it more often are going to know the trail. So they're going to be faster going through it versus like somebody's never seen it before. And there's been instances where like I've had guys look in the rearview mirror and like prevent me from passing them. There's, mean, I see it both ways, but. There's very different strategies too. And this is like personal pet peeve, guess. I don't know if it's right or wrong, but like, it's like the tortoise and the hare story. So for me, I'm just, I'm kind of the tortoise. I'm like steadily going along the whole time. I don't really take breaks. I'm just trying to get to the end. I know I have a long road ahead with the dual sport. Whereas the really fast guys, go balls to the wall and then they stop and they take a break and they chill and they have a bunch of banter and like, that's cool for them. But then what happens is I'm trucking along. And so then I pass them because they're pulled over and then pretty soon they're up my butt again and I have to pull over. And then we do this like all day long and I'm like, you please just stay ahead of me? Like, I don't like this game. So that's one of my struggles. Yeah. And we've kind of touched on this a little bit here, you know, dual sport is such a subjective term when it comes to motorcycle. It encompasses everything, Beginners, hardcore people. So whenever you have that huge mix coming together, especially in an event setting like that, sometimes there's some challenges when it comes to that. But yeah, just tell those guys to stop taking breaks. just go. uh Any other like trail etiquette type stuff that you guys can think of Um, one thing I can think of really quickly, and it's something that we really strive to do here in Fairmont dual sport riders is leave the place better. And you found it. Um, unfortunately they're in our really good at riding areas is also places that people like to, uh, play the little 5:30 clubs and ride for five minutes and drink for half hour and throw cans everywhere. Um, and Trevor can attest to this too, man. We, do our best to clean up the trail as we go along, especially if we're stopped taking a break and you look around and you can see just a bunch of trash everywhere. We do our best to pick that stuff up and we also as a club partner with Tread Lightly to pick an area that we like to ride and clean up and have like a big club wide cleanup day. So Trevor, you're into moto camping, I heard. Is there an item that you can't leave home without when you go moto camping? I don't know. Like when, when I go camping with my wife, we take my Tacoma. I have like a camper shell build out for it that we really like. And, uh, you know, volume and weight aren't really a consideration. just go to be comfortable. Right. when I go moto camping, my setup is pretty stripped down. Um, I mean, I'm not sleeping under a tarp necessarily, but I don't take, uh, I don't take an abundance of stuff, but one thing I always try to take. are just some really light shoes to wear around camp. ah That's probably my biggest luxury item because you ride for a full day, you you're sweating your boots, your feet are probably pretty nasty, and it's really nice to just be able to put some some camp shoes on or whatever and uh kick back and relax. That and a good headlamp. Probably my two. my two big must have items outside of your basics, like your sleep set up. you know, I do have an inflatable mattress that packs down pretty tight and I'm excited to try a hammock set up. I've got one. uh I plan to do more moto camping like in the past. Then I broke my wrist, got married, bought a house, had my first year home ownership and haven't really made it out to go moto camping in quite a while now. you the type to pack food and like cook out or are you like eating while you're out riding and then just kind of setting up camp for the night later? Um, I like to cook, um, within reason. If I know that I'm going to pass like a, a grocery store, I'll plan on getting a steak or something like that and cooking that over the fire. Uh, other than that, I really like freeze dried meals, cause they pack down pretty small. If you carry a decent water filter, there are plenty of places to ride past that you can get a hold of water. Um, unlike out West, One would have been 2022, I think. was at a week off between jobs and I just rode and camped for a week on National Forest. And that was one of my favorite periods of riding just in general. That was for me true freedom. That was a great experience. a lot of steaks that week and more of the cooking outside versus freeze-dried food or you know a lot of guys just eat like a pepperoni roll or whatever and call it good. which is a very West Virginia thing. So for those that aren't familiar, explain what a pepperoni roll is. So pepperoni roll was essentially a coal miners lunch in a way. is a shelf stable bread roll with pepperoni and oftentimes cheese in it. And growing up in West Virginia, I just thought it was a normal thing. And then, you know, when I was like 10 years old, I got out from the state for the first time and it's like, oh, nobody else has these. This is like a regional. a regional thing but man they're great for riding. yeah, when you're in West Virginia, a lot of places just have like homemade pepperoni rolls in the gas station, which you would think might be kind of gnarly. You might want to stay away from, but I think, I mean, they're made with a lot of love down there. They really are like Trevor was saying too. They are regional. And I remember as a kid going to the Vera Beach GNCC in Florida and going into a Shell station and I'm looking around and I don't see him anywhere. And it was kind of similar thing. First time that far away from home. And I remember asking the guy at the counter, Hey, where's your pepperoni rolls at? Pepper what? Pepper what? He kept saying it is. like we got the roller dogs over there. Let's tell people where they can connect with you guys online, follow your podcast, connect with the club. Yeah. So FDSR Fairmont dual sport riders is on Facebook. Look us up there. FDSR. am one of the group admin. So please fill out the questions. That's probably one of my biggest pet peeves about running this club is so many people will just click join and not answer any of the questions. Well, if you don't at least put what you're riding, I'm not letting you in the dual stuff. So Find us on there for FDSR, the podcast. are on YouTube as Tallboys and Trackmasters. We are on Spotify and on Facebook as well. So check us out there. I guess personally, uh Instagram, Wright Cycle Works. You can find me on there. I usually post some cool stuff on there as well. So I really don't have much social media presence outside of, know, FDSR and Tallboys and Trackmasters. uh That's something I've been kind of wanting to expand on for some time. So maybe this will be the year I'll actually start posting up some riding content or something like that for, you know, my personal YouTube page. But for now, I'm pretty much a ghost. So. An enigma. All right. Well, thanks to both of you for joining me and thanks to everybody for tuning into Momentum. This has been a production of High Gear Success. If you want to connect or recommend a guest, head to MomentumMotorsportsPodcast.com. Until next time, keep the momentum rolling.