Welcome to Momentum, a motorsports podcast powered by High Gear Success. I'm your host, Heather Wilson Schiltz Here we share the stories and strategies that keep the world of motorsports moving forward. Joining me today is Delvene Reber, promoter of AMA Land Speed Grand Championship, also known as Bonneville Motorcycle Speed Trials. So thank you for joining me. Thank you for having me. And you just got home a couple of weeks ago from the event. And I know that event takes lots and lots of time and resources and energy. So you're probably still in recovery mode a little bit. Somewhat, we're still wrapping up um the finer details of things, making sure we've filed all our appropriate paperwork, paid the appropriate bills, all of that fun stuff. So yeah, it's not done yet, but I'm also already planning next year. Yeah, people probably think when an event is over, everybody just goes home and that's that. But really there's a lot of stuff that has to be filed and cleaned up after the fact. Yeah, I'm ongoing all year, but still our volunteers are still kind of wrapping up their portions of the event as well. So it's, it's just an ongoing like, okay, what's finished, what to start and all of that stuff as we go through. Yeah. So kind of take us back. When did you first get involved with land speed racing? So, uh land speed racing started for me back in the year 2000 um in Australia, actually at Lake Gairdner My dad had been land speed racing. He built hot rods, you know, growing up. I grew up with hot rods and he had been going out to Lake Gairdner for years, wouldn't shut up about it. So finally I was just like, okay, I'm going to go and uh went out and raced. My dad didn't make it. Unfortunately, right before the event, he had a major stroke. And he wasn't able to make it, but he wanted us to take out his car. So me, my brother and our crew headed out to the salt flats. that year I was the only female driver. I was racing in a 32 Ford Roadster, open roadster. And yeah, so that's kind of where I got my salt flats racing. And that's where I met the Manning family and what was to become my husband and father-in-law. And they were racing there with the Bub Streamliner. So that's how I met the Manning family. With all of that romance ensued, I moved to the US and started working for Denis Manning. Now he's an AMA Hall of Famer and he had always wanted to start a motorcycle only event at Bonneville. And then I'm just good at organizing things. My background is in education as a teacher. So with that, I was able to. help him organize the first motorcycle event and that's when the Bub Motorcycle Speed Trial started in 2004. So it's been a long journey. Yeah. That's so cool though, that like your first experience of racing on the salt flats was so meaningful for your dad. I think that's such a cool thing. Yeah. Such a cool story to be able to take his car out and to represent women too. Well, and also, I didn't get a record that year, but I beat my older brother who had been racing out there a lot. So that was probably the most significant thing for me outside of meeting my then husband. But yeah, mean, who doesn't want to beat their older brother? um So that was a lot of fun. Yeah. And you mentioned that your background's in education. So my entire life growing up, all I ever wanted to be was a teacher. And then I kind of took this hard left in a journalism, late in my high school years, but I feel like teachers make really good event planners. Yeah, I mean, I think that's what it is. Fundamentally, I'm an organizer. I'm a planner. And I had started off by planning trade shows and events for Bub Enterprises, we sold exhaust pipes for motorcycles. And, you know, that's when it was just like Bub was like, Hey, you're really good at organizing things. And I'm like, yeah. And, you know, having moved and immigrated, I had not converted my teaching degree and all of that fun stuff. So That's what I was kind of doing for the company. It was going through some exponential growth when I immigrated as well. So I kind of never got to converting that degree until later years. yeah, so he was just like, yep, I'm an organizer at heart before I was a racer, if you will. So that kind of lends itself, I think, very well to being organized, systematic. dealing with all the things because my teaching experience is all elementary level. So it's just like dealing with first graders can somewhat be similar to dealing with motorcycle racers. So, you know, there's definitely a crossover there in what we do. Yeah, for somebody that's never been to Bonneville, how would you describe that event and that atmosphere? Um, it's unlike anything you will have ever experienced, from the landscape, obviously, you know, 40, we operate on 40 over 40 square miles of salt. Our actual operating area is more like 20 square miles. it's unusual cause it's one just big straight line, for our race course. So that, um, that changes the dynamic of where you're looking and all of that sort of stuff. So. Um, it's one of those things I'm so close to it now. I'm so used to it. it's the most prominent motorcycle racing, obviously I know. and I know I, when I go to other motorcycle events, I'm also like, it's so small. So in terms of like, I can see the whole track at once as opposed to just like one mile. but it's, it's also, I think one of the last bastions of Truly amateur motorcycle racing. Um, anyone can go out there and race. So you see such a huge variety in the motorcycles. And I think that's one thing that makes that particular event very unique in terms of Bonneville. Like it's just like, can see, you know, the fanciest of streamliners out there going for the absolute world record, but you can also see something that's like, Hey, this was my dad's like sixties BMW and I want to ride it and see how fast she'll go or. I had this in the barn and I put it together and I'm just, curious what it will do out here. um You'd be surprised how many people like touch the salt and then taste it, make sure it's salt and those sorts of things. So it's just, it's a very unusual discipline and a lot of people have had some exposure to it through movies. through just knowing that that's where people set land speed records. But until you get out there and kind of walk on that salt, it's a little surreal. Can you kind of break down you kind of mentioned that the streamliner can you paint a picture of what that looks like? Yeah, it's basically an enclosed motorcycle. So, you know, the rider will sit inside the motorcycle, it's fully encased in, you know, in body work. So it will have a roll cage, it will have a canopy. They vary in design, they kind of look like almost like a rocket. But it's still on two wheels. So it usually is very narrow. mean, I know with the Bub 7 Streamliner, it's only 22 inches wide. And so it's very unusual to see that there's a lot of different styles, different opinions on how to build a streamliner. But those are generally going for an absolute record in whatever displacement class they are. So they take a lot more to build, a lot more to design. You're looking a lot more at the aerodynamics of a motorcycle. um with those particular things. But it's just kind of like it's a rocket screaming down the salt, which is always fantastic to see when it's at its peak. I'm assuming there are also guidelines and regulations about how things can be built and probably safety features as well. Yeah, so we have different classification structures as well as requirements for what's required like minimum basic standards. so depending on like all motorcycles have to meet those minimum standards, there are some extra special rules that come into play with streamliners specifically as well because you're in an enclosed space like fire suppression, those sorts of things. And then we break down in classification. So what we're really checking uh is that those minimum standards are met. And then also what are your class requirements and those classes are broken down into displacement, then the type of engine you might have, and then the type of body work. So whether it's a naked bike versus a faired bike, whether, or it's fully encased in a streamliner. So there's kind of variations on those, those body types, it's variations on the frame classes in the, is it all custom built or is it based on a production frame or is it modified production? So, and then yeah, how big is your engine? So, yeah. When we talk about record breaking runs, are there any memorable runs that stick out in your mind and what kind of speed are we talking about? So our fastest record that's been set out there, I think would be the 367 for a streamliner. And we haven't seen those kinds of speeds for a number of years through a number of factors. know, with streamliners, bikes have to be ready. The salt conditions have to be perfect and all of that. Most of our records run between 150 to 250 mile an hour range, just because that's where the volume. of competitors run. My most memorable would be the Bub 7 Streamliner. It broke the record and between 2006 and 2010, it changed hands between two different motorcycles a number of times. And because I was involved in that motorcycle team and running that, that's probably the most memorable for me. But then I have seen, you know, I have seen my niece break. an AMA national record on a little 50cc motorcycle and some of those motorcycles that are small that go really fast for their displacement can be, you know, one of those that are recognizable. I love seeing when friends break records, you know, obviously many friends over the 20 plus years that I've been running this, or some people that have broken records that have been standing for 50 years. So there was a period of time when the AMA didn't sanction motorcycle records out on the salt flats. And so, but then there's records that date back to the fifties and fifties, sixties and seventies. there was, you know, people or records that have stood for a really long time there seeing those break. And so it's one of those like, have to go back through the memory banks. because it's just like over the years, think, I was looking up some numbers that over the years has been over 440 world records set and over I think it's over 1100 AMA national records have been set over the 21 years of me running it. So that's that's a lot of records to remember. When we're talking world records, are we talking FIM or a different? Yes. Okay. Yeah, we're the only event out on the salt flats right now that is inscribed by both the FIM for True World Records as well as the American Motorcyclist Association for the National Records. All the other events, while admirable and go very, very fast, they are actually considered club records because they don't have the national or world sanctioning bodies overseeing their records. So we answer to that higher power and coordinate with those. uh sanctioning organizations to do those world and national records. Gotcha. From what I recall too, there is kind of like a, I don't know if this is the correct terminology, but like a startup zone and then like a timing zone and kind of a shutdown area. you explain how the timing and records work? When we're looking at records or when we're talking about our tracks and our courses, we run a couple of parallel courses. We have a three, a five, and usually a seven, two, however much salt we have track, which is our long courses. So we break them down into like sub 100 motorcycles run on a three mile course. But what that is, is it's one mile run up to a one mile speed. And our timing is an elapsed time of over a mile or over a kilometer. So, and then you have another mile to break down. So that's where the three miles come in, but one mile is the only portion that is timed. So you break the clock that starts your time, you exit the clock and that's your finished elapsed time that gets converted to a speed. In order to get a record you have to then return in the opposite direction and we ensure that you have the same amount of run-up in the opposite direction. For an AMA national record it's within the same calendar day. For an FIM world record it is within two hours that you have to do your return. So that would be the same. Our five mile course is a two mile run-up, one mile trap, two miles to shut down if you need it. And then our longer courses, it just depends on what kind of bikes we might have coming out there or how much salt area back when we first started, we could get an 11 mile track. This year we could only get seven miles and that would be three miles, one mile trap, three miles to shut down. Yeah, you kind of hinted there about the changing salt conditions. So kind of talk about how that has changed over the years and, and maybe reasons for that. Yeah, it's a very complicated and a very political issue somewhat. Over the years, and we've been running a motorcycle event out there since 2004. I have many people that have been predate, you know, the first motorcycle only event. The salt cross used to be inches thick, if not feet deep back in the day. Throughout the years, the BLM. oversees the salt flat surface, so to speak, or the salt flat area. They're the ones that manage that land. There have been mining contracts where they mine the potash and the groundwater out of the salt flats and remove certain chemicals for mining purposes. And then, and so that has changed, dare I say the composition and the crust thickness. This year, particularly, We saw a very different salt flats that I've never seen because also weather will play in a factor. So the reason people race at the salt flats can be because over the winter it rains, levels everything out, makes it all nice and smooth that evaporates, allows the salt crystals to grow, create that crust, rains again, levels everything out. So you kind of have this cycle over the winter of weather kind of creating this salt. crust and surface. This year in particular, it was extraordinarily dry over the winter and extraordinarily hot summer. So we didn't see, you didn't see the salt growth and you also end up with a very, very thin crust. The problem with that is that we do actually have to prepare the surface. We don't just go out and go like, Oh, it's nice and smooth and flat. may look that way, but it's not necessarily that way for racing and specifically for motorcycles. And that's why, back in the day, we created a motorcycle only event because of the needs of motorcycles. You don't want to go after trucks and all of those creating ruts. So when we prepare the surface, there's a certain amount that we dare I say, skim the surface. have what we call drags or skids. They are. highly technical like I-beams that are welded together and dragged behind trucks. So we have those and they kind of skim the salt surface and flatten it out, but there's not enough salt cross there to do that in the same methodology that we have done for years. So this year we were able to create a different kind of drag in which had rounded basically round posts. It was actually made out of a recycled car lift. with big round posts and that compressed the salt back into the surface. So we weren't kind of cutting into it because it's just mud underneath. So the salt conditions have changed where the crust is dramatically thinner than it used to be. So that creates a whole different set of problems where the preparation is very different than it used to be. We look at geological effects that have happened 2015 2022 and 2023, we were flooded out. And so then that creates, you know, a situation where it's just like, is the salt going to recover? Is it going to recover as quickly and all of that? it's, um, weather and, and mining situation. used to pump. salt back onto the salt flats as a salt lay down project, but it's a slightly different chemical makeup. So it doesn't bind the same way. So there's lots of different theories, lots of different studies out there created. know, University of Utah has done a lot of geological studies out there. We don't have a definitive answer. You know, I won't say that the racing is a zero impact on the salt flats from the amount of salt that might come off vehicles and all of that sort of stuff. However, it is believed that the mining has had the most significant impact on that deterioration of the salt over years. And when we're talking about like operational or logistical challenges, you're spending an entire year preparing for an event that may or may not be able to happen. Right. Yeah, and that is a tricky situation. A lot of people like how are the conditions? What's the weather looking like? And to be quite honest, I don't look at those things because we have we have a set time period that we can race. There are other events before us and after us. Yes, we've been rained out a couple of times. The question always comes up. Well, why don't you move it to when it's drier? And it's just like, actually, we are in if you look at the farm farmers almanac. We are in what is considered the driest time. There is a small window of about like less than two months where traditionally that's the best time to race with the conditions out there. And that's why it's so hard to set land speed records on the salt flats, because it is a very narrow window. So we don't have rain dates because of other factors and because of the logistics, you know, we're going to a place that has no structure. So we have to bring everything we have. out there. So that kind of creates this situation where you're working and you're working and you kind of never know. And it can be hard to get motivated. I mean, for the first first 10 years and because of the conditions out there, it used to be and we've had it where it rained in the middle of the event. We sat out for a day and just let it dry and we could race the next day. But the conditions and the salt crust being what it is, those kind of situations don't happen as much anymore. We had a rain out in 2015. The other events had also been rained out in 2014, but we still ran because we found a tiny slither. We drove through six inches of salty brine water to get to the salt flats or to get to the dry portion of the track, but we still managed to run an event. But 2015, all events were rained out. And again, 2022, we were rained out and I've never seen so much water on the salts. just it came down there ended up being like six inches of water over the entire salt flats area, which is very unusual. I thought this is going to take years to recover. But, you know, the next year we're like, OK, we're good to go. And then Hurricane Hillary hit the coast of California. And I never thought a hurricane would be what like rained us out. And it pushed weather systems into Utah. And we were literally driving down the whole setup crew. were driving down and we're watching this hurricane weather and we're like, it could miss us. It could not. And we get there and it had rained and we're like, ah, okay, I think we're done. And while the water wasn't covering the whole surface, it kept moving around. So we're like, oh, we drove out and three hours later, all the water is now over here and we're like, well, we could start setting up a track, but I don't know if it's going to be underwater in three hours. So we had to cancel there. When you about driving out to the salt flats, how long does it take to get to that location? Like where, where are you coming from to get there? So generally, you know, mean, people come from all over the world, you know, initially, we are right near the border of Utah and Nevada. So there's a small little town called Wendover and West Wendover. just saddles the border there in Utah and Nevada. That's about 10 miles from the salt flats itself. The access road is three miles. And then when you get to what we call the boat ramp because of rainouts in the early years. or some people call it land's end or the end of the road. And that's the end of kind of a paved road. Then that's where there's some, know, tourist signs and all that sort of stuff. People will walk out on the salt flats. You can drive out if there's no event out there. Then our pit area itself is usually about anywhere between three and this year, I think we were five and a half miles out from the access road because we were further down because that's where the better salt was. So it takes a minute to get out there. So, and you feel like you're driving forever. Does it feel like disorienting? Like you're looking out on this just like blank white canvas? Like, do you have to use your GPS to really kind of know where you're going? Initially, yes, you know, and even for someone like me, I've been going out there for years. I've gone out multiple times a year. You know, I'm intimately familiar, but until there are some markers out there, it can be hard to tell, you know, where you are. We are lucky in that we work with the other organizations. They usually go out and they preset up one of their courses. We sometimes have shared the preparation of courses. And so usually I'm looking for certain visual markers. What is helpful is that there is a mountain range on one side and then there's the freeway on the other side for I-80. So there are certain reference points when you first get out there. There's also some like some dikes that run along and I know some visuals from mountain peaks that are on either side in order to set up the course. Like the international courses between that certain peak over on one side and that certain peak over on the other side. So, you you can kind of get oriented, but we also use, you know, our modern day tools like On-X Hunt, which is actually a hunting GPS because we're off road by then in order to be able to like figure out where we might've been set up in previous years as well. So that's always something that we find. really helpful to go year after year. you know, until you start getting markers out there, it can be difficult. We also open up and start racing not long after first light. So when we're actually operating the event, we've got cones that have reflectors on them because I'm literally driving out there at 530 in the morning before it's before before it's light so that we can get all of our workers out to their areas and all of that sort of stuff. So there's a lot of tools that we have to use in order to get that set up. We talked about the kind of speeds that people are racing, but how do you approach safety in this like open environment? Um, it's always a tricky one. we don't check bikes for safety, as it were. we're checking for rule compliance. the minimum standards is really what we speak to in terms of like what should work and what should not. it can be tricky with this particular type of racing, cause it's one of the few racing where there's some very experimental. motorcycles out there, you know, that it's just like. there could be motorcycles that have not been built in that way. Or especially, we have lay down bikes where you're like, you know, in a prone position, head first, riding your motorcycle that's the best aerodynamics because, you know, you're just looking at your helmet, and the rest of your body is behind you. So. um It can be tricky to do that. We take best practices for other motorcycle disciplines. We make sure that we're looking at rule compliance. We're making sure if there is an accident, what caused that accidents, is there any adjustments that we need to make for rules, et cetera. And then we also look at that for our core setups and how we operate the event in a whole. You know, we are looking at very high speeds. Part of it is that you're not racing against other motorcycles. So you're not on a track There's nobody out there at the same time as you you're running one after another usually with a couple of minutes of time in between I always Liken it to it's like it's the slowest fastest motorcycle racing in the world because you know a bike can go 200 miles an hour But then there's nothing for another minute and a half or two minutes and you're waiting for the next bike to come because you're racing a clock So that obviously breaks down. And then also safety buffers. We're a quarter of a mile away from the courses. we have restricted areas and everybody tends to be very, very respectful of that. And then making sure there's communication methods. We have hand radios, we have cell phones and all of that to make sure that we are respecting those areas and keeping safe. And it's really a lot of self-policing. with that kind of aspect too. I'm just like, hey, that person doesn't look like they where they should be and radio it in, everything stops. If there's an accident, the front gate, like, okay, nobody in, nobody out, in case the ambulance needs to get in or out as well. we do make sure we have our safety crews. We contract with local ambulance company and have two ambulances on site as well as a fire crew that take care of all of the fire safety. for that as well. So we make sure we have professionals on site for that. We're not just, you know, running around with fire extinguishers. Right. Do you feel like technology has changed the sport even just the years that you've been in it or has the equipment kind of stayed the same? um It varies for the administration side for sure. We have everything in a computer system, but we also have paper forms because I'm like, well, what if the internet goes down? We have nothing if we don't have that sort of stuff. But I don't know that technology in terms of the actual racing has really changed. The clocks are the clocks. we're not measuring to a different, you know, standard. We go out there, I say, for our speeds for three decimal places, those statistics haven't changed. How you measure an engine for displacement hasn't really changed. So it's really more on an admin side that that technology has helped. But, we're also talking about we have motorcycles that, you know, we actually had a motorcycle out there this year that was 100 years old. And so it's just like, so we're looking at some really old, we have vintage classes, we have classic classes. So, those guys aren't changing anything, you know. Do the bikes have like a tracker on them that is tracking the speed or it's just hand, hand clocking stuff. So the clocks themselves are all direct wire actually, like, so there's no, because you're on the salt flats, you're basically, it could be considered basically on a big gigantic battery. we have hand radios that use cell service. um You know, we used to have ones that we had a repeater and all of that sort of stuff and that created issues because, you know, line of sight and all of that sort of stuff. But now we use cell towers, cell tower radios. But this year for some reason, and it could have been because there were a number of thunderstorms were coming through. So you have a lot of electricity in the air. You're on the salt surface. So that can create some glitches. So our timing clocks are actually uh wired in directly to a timing system. And that's been very consistent. um We don't have any issues with that. So basically they're breaking a beam that is across the course for the timing. So it's just kind of like in and out that elapsed time gets converted and then we know what the speed is and the computer does all of that magic for us. being hardwired in makes a big difference for, and the timing is kind of like the Bible of all things out there. It's just like, you know, If the clocks are working, then everything else we can, we can make work. And those are all certified. We've been using the same timing organization for a long time. They do other motorcycle events, other land speed events. They've also done the events that have run in other countries such as Bolivia. we have an engineer that comes out that measures that the mile is in fact a mile, as well as the kilometer. so we have certifications for all of that for us and our sanctioning, um, to make sure it's all like, this is truly a mile that we're measuring. If someone wants to attend either as a spectator or participate in land speed racing, what do you think would be their first step to doing so? So we have a lot of information on our website at BonnevilleMST.com. I also encourage people, if they're looking into breaking into the racing, they haven't done it before, or want to come out and spectate, you can also volunteer is a great way to kind of get involved in the event to see what it's all about. Dare I say you get a little bit of the inside track with how it is. I've found some of our best races started off as volunteers. Or some of our best volunteers have started off as racers. So because they're like, okay, I did this and then, I volunteered and I'm just like, there's a lot more that goes on. And I'm sorry, I was grumpy when I had to wait in line for a little bit. So I always encourage people to volunteer because we also subsidize accommodations and food out there for our volunteers. But talking to people. about it as well. And we can always put people in contact with people that are local. It can be, it can be tricky to kind of know where do I start and all of that, but there's a lot of information there. And I can also point people in the right direction or have a number of people that I'm like, Hey, you know, you're in this area. Why don't you contact them? So we do have a number of people that come out there because they know somebody that raced as well. Spectators are always welcome. It is a tricky spectator sport because of our distance from the track, because it's just like one bike at a time. So it can be kind of boring. But what is really unique is that we have an open pit area. So all spectators, any people that come out and visit can walk through the pits. can talk to racers. um Everything's really accessible. It's a gigantic family out there. I mean, we even have motorcyclists that loan. people that are competing against them, like different bike parts, because they, you everyone wants to race out there. that it's a unique environment in that you can go, you can get up close and personal, if you will, with the races that are out there or just like, I've got something like that at home. And they, you know, they're always happy to talk to people. but the, the best place to start is always our website to take a look at things. get some information, get on a mailing list and stuff like that as well. I've seen some phenomenal sunrise and sunset pictures out on the salt flats. So do you have a favorite? Do you like sunrise, sunset? You know, it does vary. The sunrise is always nice because it's usually right after I've had my meeting with my staff and my volunteers and, our races are trickling out depending on what their objectives are. Cause we don't have a set schedule, if you will. We don't say like this class races at this time. It's pretty much first come first serve. So, know, racers sometimes are like, I broke this thing and it's going to take me three hours to fix it and then I'll get back in line. So, and you can see different bikes. So, sunrise can be good because it's just like, it's a bit of a lull and it's just like, okay, all of my volunteers are doing what they need to do. So I'm like, okay, what's next? Sunsets I like as well, because you kind of have the mountains in the background and when it goes down there, that's also for me personally, a quiet time because it's just like, Racing has done it at usually at six. All my meetings are done. People have left and I'm wrapping up things and there's a kind of an eerie calm that's out there because nobody camps on the salt except for a couple of our night security that kind of stay out there in the pit area. We usually have somebody at the access road as well as our night security. And sometimes that's my only opportunity to really catch up with some. some of our participants and our friends. And we have some crews that on one particular night do a volunteer barbecue and they bring in, it started with Al lamb back in the day where he's from Texas. So he'd bring his smoker out and he would be smoking meat for days Then we have some other friends, Aaron Okonek and Mike Garcia run a sport fishing business up in Alaska. They'd bring halibut. And so this year it was halibut tacos. And so that can sometimes be my only opportunity to kind of sit down and chat with our participants, catch up with people that have been coming out there for years. So, you know, that kind of lull and watching the sunset is just like, okay, today is done. Get this wrapped up. Okay, back at it, because I'm going to be up out of bed at 4.30 tomorrow morning. Yeah, long, long days for sure. days, very long days. And it's hard to kind of convey that. Like, it's just like, okay, there's, there's a lot. We race for 11 hours a day. We start racing at seven. We finish at six. We don't take breaks for lunch. Lunch gets delivered. People can kind of rotate, but it's just like, it's really long days. So it's just like, how do I get volunteers to come out there? But still like, like, yeah, it's a lot of work. So you're gonna be really tired. Right. So we mentioned the website. Is there any other places that people can connect with your event? With our event in particular, most of it goes through our website, our Facebook page and social medias. We're not super active on that. It's a matter of getting volunteers to help with those aspects. And so we do post there when we can. It's mostly active around the event. um So those are the main places. There are a few other websites like landracing.com that covers a lot of organizations. They do also support some stuff with forums and whatnot. And then through the American Motorcyclists Association, they do have their land speed page under their racing section. So you can get some additional information through there as well as the FIM has a land speed website those are good places for people to start, depending on what kind of record you're looking for. Yeah. And I will put those links in the show notes as well. So it's easy for people to find. Thanks for tuning into Momentum. This has been a production of High Gear Success. If you want to connect or recommend a guest, head to MomentumMotorsportsPodcast.com. Until next time, keep the momentum rolling.